The Landing at Evergreen, Revived?

[tefen]

Just perusing the Vancouver Business Journal's website, and ran across <a href="http://www.vbjusa.com/stories/2007-12-21/outlook_normalizing.html">this article</a> about new developments in Clark County.

Some interesting stuff in there, including: a new developer has taken on what was formerly known as the Landing at Evergreen at the former Evergreen Airport site on Mill Plain Boulevard. Portland developers Tom Kemper and Bruce Wood are included in Evergreen Landing Development LLC, and are in negotiations with national retailers for what is to be called The Village at Evergreen.

Construction is expected to begin in 2008, completing in spring of 2009.

It doesn't say much about what plans they're working off of, but I would suspect that they've made good use of the prior work on the site plan.



Another interesting quote, is this: there may be a surplus of development in East County, said Brett Irons of Coldwell Banker Commercial Jenkins-Bernhardt Assoc. And there hasn’t been as much leasing action as anticipated this year, Lindloff added.

It would seem that the huge growth that the East side has been experiencing for a decade or so could possibly be starting to slow. I know there's a couple large projects still going on out there, but certainly not the number there have been in the past.

<a href="http://tinyurl.com/ys7aq2">Here's the map</a> I've been trying to keep updated as I hear about commercial and industrial developments.

[Chief]

It's a slow time of year for development too...

Good find on the Landing at Evergreen. I'd heard there was someone else looking into it, but nothing specific yet. I als hear that they will develop that property in pieces now, and likely have less of a housing compnent to it.

[Waterbuffalo]

I'd like to add I hope there is a plaque put up for Wayne Olson or the former owner of the airport for what he did for the City and airport.

Now back to the subject:

I am keep on what the plans are for the development. Do have some thinking it might be nice to have a housing development that is as big as some of the Cookie Cutter crud off Burton/18th street. I'd like the housing to have some interesting makes on it as well.

Though I do suspect Chief's comments were close to being on, though I don't hope that old airport is turned into another strip mall/retailer shack.. Have enough of those in Vancouver all ready.

[Chief]

It's supposed to have a mix of development that's a bit less dependent on the high-ticket Condos.

We need to keep up on this because it's a great comparision to make with the continuing saga of the Boise Cascade downtown. Compare what the City is being asked to do by Gramor, and what they are being asked to do for the Landing.

[Waterbuffalo]

Look at the huge difference both pieces get? Which one gets more attention from the Council and which one gets the shrift?

Can you tell me which one gets more traffic past it? I'd bet Gramor minus I-5 and BNSF will get 1/10 what Evergreen Plaza gets in one hour off Mill Plain from people coming from the East and North East to get on to I-205 and on to Portland for a job. What intersection or series of intersections has the "WORST" traffic problems?

Honestly, Mill Plain is WORSE than CRCP.. More goods and money flow up to the business parks, Columbia Tech and several 131st/136 and 164th/192nd avenue business districts than 1/10 of what downtown shows now?? Add to that all the commuters that stop for breakfast, do banking or get stuff at the stores along Mill Plain before going home from work. Please tell me I am not full-of-it?

[Waterbuffalo]

Looks like I got a little grough in my last post. Lets hope that the City of Vancouver gets some really "SPECIAL" put in that place. That whole section of land could be a show piece instead of another retailer-mart-ville list most of the East side is.

[Chief]

Ya know.....

The City of Vancouver wants a new City Hall....

;D

[Waterbuffalo]

:-) <SHOCKED..>

Are you telling me you think Vancouver needs a new City Hall off Mill Plain? The shock, the horror of the thought? <grin>

[Chief]

Call it the new "City Center"...

[Waterbuffalo]

LOL! :-) The new City Center..

Nah, they'll just park the new city hall off General Anderson Avenue right next to the Skating Rink and all the rest of the General OPs center for Vancouver.

I'd like to make another heads up for Tefen, you might want to look at adding A HELL of a lot of development land that sitting along 164th Avenue to 192 Avenue from 18th street all the way up to 28th Street. Its basically Al's Bowling Alley all the way to the Walmart on 192nd Avenue.

If your looking for a huger piece of developable land than The Landing at Evergreen, take a look there.

Chief, have you driven the area just North of Natilus before? Might want to take a second and see how much land there is. Even more than off 136th Avenue near Firstenburg.

[tefen]

I'm aware of that land, but I was flagging developments that are actually in progress. To that end, I have Clark College's East Campus and the new Lowes in there. I think there's a JC Penny's going in, but I don't know the exact (or even approximate) location.

[Waterbuffalo]

Tefen, Expect a heck of a lot more building over in those areas as well as up near Minnehaha and Saint Johns Blvd. area as soon as it becomes part of the City of Vancouver.

Sure a lot of land for development..

[tefen]

More about this development in the Columbian today

http://columbian.com/business/businessNews/2008/01/01102008_New-developer-takes-over-project.cfm


I find it interesting that it says they're going to "sell off the eastern portion of the tract set aside for a hotel and offices, as well as the housing component"

If I remember right this project was zoned as mixed use, and the city council wasn't pleased with the plan that essentially built a strip mall with single family homes on the back half of the property rather than an actual mixed use development. Now, if they're selling off those other pieces, what have they got? Just the strip mall, which is what the zoning was desperately trying to avoid.

A very nice stripmall for sure, but still a purely commercial development.

Any bets on whether the buyer of the other portions of the project follows through on the plans as they stand?

[Chief]

"We're planning on three anchors," Kemper said, calling the development a "power lifestyle center" similar to Bridgeport Village in Tigard, Ore. The upscale complex is filled with popular boutiques such as Mario's, Chico's and Crate & Barrel.

I think you called it tefen...a very nice strip mall indeed.

It's no surprize that they are going to focus on the retail portion, and ease off the housing component. Look at what new home construction is doing in the County right now, and you'll have the reason why this has changed.

Now, just for fun? Here's a little thought problem for you:

What would new housing construction look like if the IDD Levy had passed? As all those jobs ramped up, what effect would that have on the housing markets in Clark County??

Just for fun...

[Waterbuffalo]

To your question if the IDD levy passed, any thing could be a possibility.

But since it didn't pass, now the cackler is coming to roost and we're getting what we voted for.

Now do I want another strip mall? If you look all over Mill Plain from 112 th Avenue to 192 Avenue, what is the predominated landscape and zoning?

Sorry but I think that the CIty should cry foul and try to restart the Landing at Evergreen. But heck, I don't think that would ever happen when they're focused on Downtown Vancouver and the float-sam around there.

[Chief]

Look at the huge difference both pieces get? Which one gets more attention from the Council and which one gets the shrift?

Can you tell me which one gets more traffic past it? I'd bet Gramor minus I-5 and BNSF will get 1/10 what Evergreen Plaza gets in one hour off Mill Plain from people coming from the East and North East to get on to I-205 and on to Portland for a job. What intersection or series of intersections has the "WORST" traffic problems?

Honestly, Mill Plain is WORSE than CRCP.. More goods and money flow up to the business parks, Columbia Tech and several 131st/136 and 164th/192nd avenue business districts than 1/10 of what downtown shows now?? Add to that all the commuters that stop for breakfast, do banking or get stuff at the stores along Mill Plain before going home from work. Please tell me I am not full-of-it?

You're not full of it WB. Let's not forget that without a substantial investment by the City and others, Gramor can't even get access to that piece of land, hence no traffic into it at all.

The Evergreen Development doesn't need any financial participation by the City, nor does it qualify for any of the tax breaks that Gramor has already landed (10 year exclusions).

That's the way development ought to go, if a project is viable, it will stand on it's own without any tax dollars.

[Waterbuffalo]

Thanks for copying one of my famous posts.. :-)

I just REMEMBER that one.

But the discussion turned away from that message to what they are going to do with it according to your and tefen's latter comments. I don't want to see another higher end retail.

If one goes to Columbia Tech Center, what is all that land turned into? If you look around, most of it isn't housing, row upon row of Van Mall apartments, old folks condominiums or small ventures of decent accomodated, wonderful businesses.

There are few exception to my latter comment, like Al's Bowling, McMenamins, and Gustav's but if you look around, almost 50+ percent is strip mall and more strip mall. Add to that all, there are strip Malls all along Highway 503 north of me near 117th Street?

Sorry guys but take the Landing back to the hangar and redo it, there is so much retail and office development its sick.

Read Vancouver Business Journal in the Dec. 20th Edition or so, there is an article there with office park and office layouts right now can't support the prices they are asking for. Same thing is said about all the condos and apartments that are not being built.

About the only thing that seems to be up and coming, is industrial park need that still needs higher levels of lease or rental commitments before they are going to be built in the future.

Vancouver is starting to price themselves out of Industrial lands and the jobs associated with them. Most of the companies that are moving here are going up to Kalama or Ports north like Ridgefield.

Yes, there are some rail dependent companies that need marine access moving to the Port of Vancouver but look at all the rest of the companies that are moving here.

Chief, the Ridgefield area is BOOOMING, just north of the I-5/205 junction. A lot of companies want to to locate in that area because if there is a bottleneck on I-5, they can always use I-205 to get across and into Oregon to service customers.

Well i better get off my soapbox and respond to other threads.

[Chief]

There is only so much retail/Commercial that the community can support. At some time you need to start helping Industrial tenants to come in and set up large production facilities.

Think on the scale of what the Port of Vancouver had planned via the IDDL...that's the kind of development we really need.

[Waterbuffalo]

For years, the mayor has been flagering on about how he wants to stop people from going across the River. Even Tim Leavitt has said it as well.

The problem is there is a limit to that reality like you said Chief.


I'd love to see more industrial lands but the problem is there is two certain factions against building more of that "enviromentalist" and "political wanderers."

So instead of my going on and on, what would be good for this site? If retail isn't economical, housing is in a slump and industrial won't pass muster there, what is the answer?